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Pastafaries = Religion?
#94
(23-07-2011, 23:36)Mustafa schrieb: Ockhams Messer mag für die Naturwissenschaft bedeutend sein, aber nicht für die ganze menschliche Realität.
Occam's razor bezieht sich heute nur auf die naturwissenschaftliche Theoriebildung, zu Occams Zeiten auf die Ökonomie, und wird hier munter für eine unübersichtliche Vielfalt von Aussagen verwendet, die im weitesten Sinne Beziehungen beschreiben wollen: Beziehungen der Menschen in und durch Kommunikation. Solche Beziehungen beruhen auf Vereinbarungen, die man nicht einfach wegschneiden kann, ohne sie aus der Diskussion zu drängen. Beispiele sind rechtliche Regeln, die Liebe zwischen Menschen, subjektive Lebenserfahrungen, das Verhältnis zu einer Landschaft und ihren Einwohnern, Tierliebe, usw. Ich hatte eingangs mit Bedacht auf die Religionen verwiesen. Religion gehört zu den Beziehungen im weitesten Sinne des Wortes: Sie besteht aus jeder Menge an Vereinbarungen und Gemeinsamkeiten zwischen Menschen. Streicht man solche (impliziten) Vereinbarungen zusammen, so bricht eine Gesellschaft auseinander, weil (zuvor, bzw. dadurch) ihre Beziehungen verarmen.

(23-07-2011, 23:46)Tyko schrieb: Eine nicht wissenschaftliche erklärung ist keine erklärung sondern spekulation ohne anhaltspunkte. wenn wir die welt nicht durch rationalismus, logik und evidentialismus erklären können können wir sie garnicht erklären.
Natürlich nicht bzw. nicht nur! Du schreibst über Hilfsmittel zur Absicherung von Mitteilungen über Dinge (Sachen).
Sobald du jedoch subjektive Beziehungen vor dir hast, wirst du die (impliziten menschlichen) Konventionen (schon allein der Sprache) in dein eigenes Beziehungsgeflecht einbauen müssen. Und das ist nicht einfach Resultat von Spekulation(en) sondern von Antworten anderer Individuen (und seien sie in langen Texten niedergeschrieben).

(23-07-2011, 23:36)Mustafa schrieb: Ich halte noch immer an meinem necessitarismus fest, also einer absoluten form des determinismus.
Hier sind wir ganz eng am Thema. Denn die beiden Begriffe stellen lediglich eine unbeweisbare Grundannahme deinerseits (und Vieler anderer) dar, wie dies auch bei Religion der Fall ist.

Die Natur kümmert sich um all dies nicht. Im Grunde wollen wir Menschen nur experimentelle Methoden und deren Beschreibung, um sie für unsere divergierenden Interessen ausnutzen zu können.

Es gilt gewissermaßen: Sobald wir das nun wissen, können wir uns den "schöneren Dingen des Lebens" (unseren Beziehungen) widmen.
Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Ekkard
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Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 22-07-2011, 13:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ottaviani - 22-07-2011, 14:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 22-07-2011, 15:11
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 22-07-2011, 15:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 22-07-2011, 15:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 23-07-2011, 10:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 11:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 12:32
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 12:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Romero - 23-07-2011, 14:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 14:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 07:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 20:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 08:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 14:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 17:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 17:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 17:51
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 19:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 21:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 22:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 23:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:37
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 00:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 06:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 17:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 20:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 27-07-2011, 21:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 28-07-2011, 07:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 27-07-2011, 21:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 21:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 21:15
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 22:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 22:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 23:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 22:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 22:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 28-07-2011, 08:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 27-07-2011, 00:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 22-07-2011, 15:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 22-07-2011, 23:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 10:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 23-07-2011, 10:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 20:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 16:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 20:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 21:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 22:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 22:43
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 22:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 17:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 27-07-2011, 23:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 27-07-2011, 23:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 28-07-2011, 00:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Artist - 26-07-2011, 22:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 23:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 23-07-2011, 12:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 12:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 13:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 13:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 13:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 15:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:59
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:51
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 17:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 18:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:09
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 17:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 14:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 14:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 14:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 14:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:22
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:29
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 15:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 15:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:16
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:24
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 16:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 16:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 08:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 16:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 17:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 17:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 17:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 18:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 23-07-2011, 18:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 18:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 19:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 19:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 23-07-2011, 20:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 20:11
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 20:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 20:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 21:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 25-07-2011, 20:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 25-07-2011, 20:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 25-07-2011, 22:16
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 25-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 08:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 26-07-2011, 21:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 21:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 21:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 21:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 22:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 22:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 23:15
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 23-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 23-07-2011, 23:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 00:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 00:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 10:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 18:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 18:31
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 18:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 19:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 19:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 21:26
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 24-07-2011, 22:54
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 24-07-2011, 22:25
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 22:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 22:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:01
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:35
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 22:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:46
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 24-07-2011, 23:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 24-07-2011, 23:58
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:08
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:12
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:14
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:18
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:23
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:28
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:30
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:32
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:34
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:41
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 00:47
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 00:50
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 25-07-2011, 01:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 12:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Karla - 25-07-2011, 13:48
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 14:05
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 25-07-2011, 20:55
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 25-07-2011, 22:17
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 26-07-2011, 19:42
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 19:53
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von indymaya - 26-07-2011, 20:07
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 26-07-2011, 20:39
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Theodora - 26-07-2011, 07:56
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von d.n. - 26-07-2011, 09:57
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 14:21
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 19:38
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 26-07-2011, 23:20
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 26-07-2011, 23:45
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 26-07-2011, 23:49
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 27-07-2011, 00:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 27-07-2011, 00:02
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Mustafa - 27-07-2011, 00:44
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 28-07-2011, 10:36
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 17:00
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 03-08-2011, 09:52
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von ChinaBlue - 03-08-2011, 11:40
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Ekkard - 08-08-2011, 17:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 18:04
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 18:13
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von humanist - 08-08-2011, 19:19
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 21:03
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 19:27
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von petronius - 08-08-2011, 21:10
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 21:33
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von David - 08-08-2011, 22:06
RE: Pastafaries = Religion? - von Gundi - 08-08-2011, 22:16

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